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True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Question
1) Aspen Pro EFD 1000 (Primary Flight Display)
2) S-Tec 55X Autopilot
3) S-Tec 30 Autopilot
4) Century 2000 Autopilot
Obviously I would not be installing all three autopilots but rather these are the options I'd consider having researched the options fairly extensively. I realize there is plenty of room and probably energy to debate which option is best and why. The point of this post is not to debate those issues but rather to survey those who HAVE actually installed these items and ask if you would be willing to share the final resulting cost of installing one or more of these in a Comanche aircraft.
The manufacturers of this equipment provide fairly accurate parts cost but the install labor is where I get a very WIDE distribution of claimed cost. Some of the more expensive shops claim their price is more realistic and the cheaper shops are either cutting corners or low-balling. The lesser priced shops claim the more expensive shops are just over priced. Hence my interest in getting any feedback on real world installations in Comanche aircraft.
Since these are all things installed in the airframe independent of the engines I assume (famous last words) that there would be little variation in cost between PA-24 and PA-30 aircraft. Mine is a PA-30 "B" Twin (1968).
Any feedback or thoughts on true install cost would be appreciated. If you are willing to comment on amounts paid, could you also comment on the year installed (I'll factor inflation) and whether your install experience was positive or negative.
Many Thanks in advance to those who will chime in...
- Charles
Charles Schefer- Posts: 563
- Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:09 pm
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
Century installed a 2000 as a sponsor for the 1994 world race so can't comment on expense. Can say we remain happy with the function accuracy - taking tuning every once in awhile.
Patricia Jayne (Pat) Keefer ICS 08899
PA-39 #10 Texas
N3322G- ICS member
- Posts: 1911
- Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 1:58 pm
- Location: Fort Worth, Texas area
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
We have an stec 50 ( same as 30 except the computer is in the panel, same function as the 30 ) this was installed in 2003, 6 k for the unit, about 3 k for the install back then.
Just did the aspen pro 1000 in jan. 10k installed, but I did give the shop my servicable kcs 55 HSI system. I also completely stripped the interior, all side panels, flooring, etc, and reinstalled after the work was completed. That saves the tech a bunch of time, and money on our side. In my research 12.5, here in so cal was the average, 15 k was the high end. JVB was also around the 10k range, and he would have been my first choice, but I was just too far away.
Love , love , love the aspen. Thier customer support is outstanding. Interfaces with the stec flawlessly.
The only sqawk I had was with magnetic interference from the trim cables. I replaced the overhead speaker with a shielded magnet kind, and called Aspen about degaussing procedures for the trim cables. The tech rep met me that day, at my plane, with a degausser, and spent an hour with me doing the procedure, recalibrating the compass, and fine tuning the pitch and roll. No charge and was just pleased as could be to make their customers happy. Really cool.
The amount of information when flying ifr is great.
Good luck
Andrew
61 250
- Andrew Foster
- ICS member
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Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
Kristin Winter- ICS member
- Posts: 1299
- Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 5:21 pm
- Location: Northern California
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
FYI,
I just purchased a used STEC 55X from another Twin Comanche member. I am trying to get it installed before going to Oshkosh in a month from now. My primary avionics shop quoted me 62 hours in labor maximum. They also said I could help out with some of the installation by removing the interior and mounting the servos and running the wiring. I think the answer you are looking for is 62 hours labor. That was based on their last installation of the STEC 55X. I think it would also help if you removed the interior yourself. That will save you at least 8 hours in labor.
Hans told me, when he installed his Century 2000 with the help of JVB a few years ago. He did a lot of the running the wires and mounting the servos. It apparently isn't hard, just grunt work that eats up time. Maybe you could do something similar. I hope this helps. FWIW.
Jeff Aryan
- jeffrey aryan
- ICS member
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- Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2004 5:21 am
- Location: Chino, CA (So-Cal)
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
Not sure from your post if you're asking an installing shop to share the "cost" of installing, or just the info on how much, but I'd think you could get some good info from Richard Kurtz of Bakersfield Avionics. 661-393-1872 or avionics@ncinternet.net
They are long time ICS members and Twinco drivers, and have installed an Aspen and C-2000 in theirs. Actually, if I remember right, Aspen used their Twinco for the certification.
About 6 years ago they installed an Aspen PFD and C-2000 in my then 250 Comanche.
And 2+ years ago the Aspen PFD and MFD, and C-2000 with altitude pre-select in my now 30B Miller Twin.
Both those included a lot of other stuff, so I have no idea myself of the breakdown between avionics even, and other stuff.
1 caveat - My Twin has a Robertson installation in which a conflicting autopilot servo had been relocated. That created problems for the C-2000 installation STC requiring a delay, tho I've no idea of it's cost.
Seems no matter what, crap happens, especially in these old, ( but good!), airplanes.
Good luck and good hunting,
Best regards, Don
PS,
BTW, You might be interested in that the Comanche Flyer Foundation (CFF) is planning a Comanche Pilot Proficiency Program (CPPP) for the Leesburg area, possibly in October.
Dn
Don Nelson- ICS member
- Posts: 312
- Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2003 5:57 pm
- Location: Burlington, Washington; KBVS
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
In November 2012 I had J. A. Air install an STEC 50, with a servicable Autopilot DG, and Stec GPSS in my 260B after the original Piper Autocontrol II unit failed. Total cost was $18,390. I had provided the hole for the STEC 50 already in my Ron and John's panel, so that maybe saved a couple of hours of install time. I had other quotes that were up to $2800 higher. I was very happy with the work at J.A. Air, and unit has worked flawlessly so far. Hope this helps,
Joe Hand
N9023P
- JMH23
- ICS member
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Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
- Charles
Charles Schefer- Posts: 563
- Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:09 pm
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
Century has the STC. I have some spare components. Email me at kristin_winter at comcast dot net and we can discuss.
Kristin Winter- ICS member
- Posts: 1299
- Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 5:21 pm
- Location: Northern California
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
My first step will probably be to send in my old Altimatic III control head. Alan said based on the symptoms I described the problem may be there. The AIII has an altitude sensor bellows that is no longer available - which I knew - but Alan says they can integrate a new digital sensor to replace it if needed. They will analyze the problem for a flat $200 fee.
- Charles
Charles Schefer- Posts: 563
- Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:09 pm
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
Patricia Jayne (Pat) Keefer ICS 08899
PA-39 #10 Texas
N3322G- ICS member
- Posts: 1911
- Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 1:58 pm
- Location: Fort Worth, Texas area
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
- Charles
Charles Schefer- Posts: 563
- Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:09 pm
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
Kristin Winter- ICS member
- Posts: 1299
- Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 5:21 pm
- Location: Northern California
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
If you do decide to go with the Aspen Pro EFD, consider also installing an Aspen ACU (EA100). The ACU allows DG and attitude information to come from the Aspen Pro EFD unit directly to your autopilot. No other input required.
That is what I very recently had done on my Comanche - and it is pretty amazing. JVB did the install and found the combination made the aircraft handling quite precise.
Regards,
Bill
- WMD
- ICS member
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- Joined: Sat May 03, 2008 4:42 am
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
The other components are the display, and the antenna unit( this unit also has integral in it a oat sensor and a magnometer)
Andrew
- Andrew Foster
- ICS member
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- Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2004 9:22 pm
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
My autopilot is the C2000 which may be why it required the extra box. JVB told me it was "interesting" finding a place to mount the second box. From Aspen's website - http://www.aspenavionics.com/products/e ... autopilots
How do you find the flight control using the Aspen to supply DG and Attitude information to your STEC?
Regards,
Bill
- WMD
- ICS member
- Posts: 12
- Joined: Sat May 03, 2008 4:42 am
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
I do not have the synthetic vision, but I hear it's cool. Much like automatic vs manual transmission.
I'm thinking about adding the trig transponder to add ads b compliance and TIS to the display.
We'll see. Trying to get through my baffle project as it is
Good luck
Andrew
- Andrew Foster
- ICS member
- Posts: 161
- Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2004 9:22 pm
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
FYI,
If you can afford it buy two Aspens do so. Then you will get a back-up and you can put some moving map functions on it. You will also be able to eliminate a couple of other things according to your instrument setup. I want to do that to my plane.
Also, the synthetic vision is nice but not really worth the money they are asking for it. There is a 20 percent markup on the retail end, so if you subtract the 20 percent it's not bad. I would try to wait for a AOPA event or an airshow too haggle with price. Talk to the Aspen sales rep and make a deal with him. Then go to your avionics shop and tell them they will be getting a call from the sales rep because Aspen won't let anyone but a authorized shop do an installation the synthetic vision takes about 1-2 hours labor.
On the ADS-B front, my shop says to wait and see what is going on with ADS-B. The FAA has finalized what it can and can't do. There are too many variables right now with the system the way it is set up. I think waiting is a good thing on this. FWIW.
Please keep everyone informed of your progress.
Jeff Aryan
- jeffrey aryan
- ICS member
- Posts: 243
- Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2004 5:21 am
- Location: Chino, CA (So-Cal)
Re: True Installed Cost of [Aspen / S-Tec / Century] Questio
I Would love to do a second one, but it's just not in the budget.
The trig transponder is a cost effective solution for TIS. The ads -b is just a bonus .
Thanks for the feedback about the synthetic vision.
Andrew
- Andrew Foster
- ICS member
- Posts: 161
- Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2004 9:22 pm