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Oil cooler plate for cold weather
Doug David- ICS member
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Wed May 20, 2009 1:17 pm
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
dap8@comcast.net
- David Pyle
- ICS member
- Posts: 372
- Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2003 10:33 pm
- Location: Houston
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
- Ray B
- ICS member
- Posts: 144
- Joined: Wed Dec 23, 2009 6:02 am
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
-Zach
Zach Grant L1011jock- Technical Advisor
- Posts: 1404
- Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 4:35 pm
- Location: Indianapolis KEYE
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
Right...but it is duct rather than the edible duck.
dap8@comcast.net
- David Pyle
- ICS member
- Posts: 372
- Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2003 10:33 pm
- Location: Houston
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
Zach Grant L1011jock- Technical Advisor
- Posts: 1404
- Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 4:35 pm
- Location: Indianapolis KEYE
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
Doug David- ICS member
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Wed May 20, 2009 1:17 pm
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
Other Pipers have them so why not the PA-24's & 30"s?
Steen
- steen
- ICS member
- Posts: 168
- Joined: Thu Sep 30, 2004 3:24 am
- Location: Palatine, Il. USA
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
They don't exist. Whether they are needed or not is also a question to bat around. Legally, since none are offered (if they were needed they would have been developed by the mfg) they aren't needed so why are people asking about them in the first place? I'm sure your airplane is 100% legal in all other ways...100% conforming to the production and type certificates!:-)
Zach
Zach Grant L1011jock- Technical Advisor
- Posts: 1404
- Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 4:35 pm
- Location: Indianapolis KEYE
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
I sure hope so re all my planes legalities as I have always tried very hard to make sure everything used or attached to them is per original or STC'd.
We all know the Twinkie needs the block plates on the oil coolers.....I am sure mine isn't the only one that flies 4 hr. trips and the oil temps never get over 160.
I think the cowls were such a far-out reach for Piper...only 9 years before I flew one of the first PA-24's Piper built my PA-12 so progress was swift....that they were worried more about getting enough cooling and never dreamed their cowl design was so good that oil temps would be a problem.
The real question I guess I'm asking is why hasn't someone come up with a field approval, if not an STC, to use the PA-28-160 oil cooler plates on the PA-30?
Maybe I'll look into this with my local GADO.
Steen
- steen
- ICS member
- Posts: 168
- Joined: Thu Sep 30, 2004 3:24 am
- Location: Palatine, Il. USA
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
Charlie Tripp- ICS member
- Posts: 382
- Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2002 5:38 pm
- Location: Brownsville, TN
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
If working properly the vernatherm should prevent the oil from circulating through the oil cooler before it reaches operating temperature. I have heard anecdotal evidence of the oil congealing in the oil cooler at extremely low temps before the vernatherm valve opened. My guess is that this is a problem that should never occur with the newer synthetic oils with their vastly improved cold pour qualities.
A caution for anyone living within 2-300 miles east of the Continental Divide: Don't EVER cover up your oil cooler unless you have checked the air temperatures aloft. In a "Chinook" situation one commonly encounters warm overrunning air. Here in Southern Alberta it is not uncommon to have surface air temperatures as low as -15C yet find the OAT at +5C just a couple of thousand feet aloft.
Don Ostergard
c-flhv@magtech.ca
- Don Ostergard
- ICS BOD member
- Posts: 63
- Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2004 6:59 pm
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
Re the vernatherms, been there and done that and they run cold in the winter, period.(PA30B)
Steen
- steen
- ICS member
- Posts: 168
- Joined: Thu Sep 30, 2004 3:24 am
- Location: Palatine, Il. USA
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
Doug David- ICS member
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Wed May 20, 2009 1:17 pm
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
In the belief that no sacrifice is too great when it comes to adding to the knowledge base that exists within ICS, (and in the interest of geting it into the hands of our fellow members without undue delay) my wife and I decided to fly our Comanche down to central Mexico, knowing that we would encounter a wide range of OAT's along the way. So here is what we found:
OAT -20C........Oil temp 177F
OAT -17C........Oil temp 184F
OAT -14C........Oil temp 186F
OAT -01C........Oil temp 189F
OAT +07C........Oil temp 188F
OAT +19C .......Oil temp 184F
Based on the above, one can conclude that if the vernatherm valve is operating properly on a PA24-250, the oil temp tends to remain quite uniform throughout the OAT range of Minus 20C to Plus 19C. It should be evident that I have no intention of beginning to cover my oil cooler in winter. I will continue the course that I have followed for the past 31 years.
I am now facing a bit of a dilemma. I'd like to stay here in this pleasant little Mexican town awaiting some higher OAT's so that I can gain more knowledge about oil cooling at higher ambient temperatures, yet I know that the later I head back north the lower the likelihood of encountering REALLY cold OAT's once I get home. Which will of course means that we won't be able to learn as much as we might wish to regarding the oil temp/OAT relationship at extremely low OAT's. In the meantime, I think I'll have another beer while I think about what to do next.
Don Ostergard ICS 3263
c-flhv@magtech.ca
- Don Ostergard
- ICS BOD member
- Posts: 63
- Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2004 6:59 pm
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
Thank you for your sacrifice in briging us this information. I'm sure I speak for the silent masses, in saying I hope you didn't put yourself out in finding this information on such a long flight. I commend you on your judicious use of beer, and hope that after a few more, and some time to think about it, you may considder the flight back north...or not...we probably have adiquate data from your arduous data aquisition flight down.
Zach
Zach Grant L1011jock- Technical Advisor
- Posts: 1404
- Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 4:35 pm
- Location: Indianapolis KEYE
Re: Oil cooler plate for cold weather
I didn't want to hijack this thread but wanted to hear more about your trip so I started a thread under new destinations; "Mexico in Search of Truth". If you have a moment between beers you could fill us in?
Thanks, Don
- 9089P
- ICS member
- Posts: 426
- Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 7:01 am