Just purchased a Comanche 180 and I'm looking for someone who can help me with the annual. Airplane is based at F69, just north of Addison, so anywhere in the DFW area would work for me. I can be reached here or via my cell at 972-489-0592.

Jim Queen

Hi Jim,

Welcome to Comanche ownership. I place a high value on having a mechanic who knows Comanches well and stock common parts. I fly down to Clifton Aero - a bit south of Ft Worth at 7F7. Tim will fly you home and pick you up if need be. He advertises in the Flyer and the Feb Flyer has some of my thoughts on the Twin's 2010 annual at Clifton.

There are also other fine mechanics in the area. Tim and crew don't have to be paid for the learning curve.

Hope this helps.

Tim Talley (Clifton Aero) did a pre-purchase for me... can't say enough good things about him...

Jim

I have been to Tim's shop and see how he operates. As an A&P/IA I have seen a few shops in my time. Go to Tim. You won't be sorry.

At the request of a buyer I took a Comanche 260B that I was selling to Tim for a prebuy.

Tim found a "few" things wrong that I did not know about. The prospect did not buy it.

That was the start of my relationship with Tim...he don't pull no punches.

Don't expect your first annual to be cheap...

It is not uncommon when taking an aircraft to a quality mechanic that knows the aircraft that the first annual can be a little pricey as he/she finds things that have been missed for years. It is a mistake to think that all annuals from that same mechanic will be expensive as it is a function of playing catch up with neglected items. It is worth biting the bullet the first time as you get a safer and more reliable aircraft as a result.

Kristin,

We are on the same page. But let's say I just bought a PA24-180 for $40K (which is about the average price today) and my first annual costs $10K. How do I feel about my purchase at that point? With any annual there are discretionary items that are not airworthiness considerations. A new owner may not understand that. Clifton Aero IS thorough and time is money. Just adding a heads up here.

When I do pre-purchase inspections, I am particularly looking for things that might cost the buyer in the first couple of years. That is what makes a pre-purchase different from an annual, the latter being a snap shot of whether the aircraft meets the minumum standards for airworthiness. So the first thing I would say if you get a bill for an annual inspection that equaled 20% of the purchase price that you must not have gotten a proper prepurchase inspection.

The other thing that I tell new buyers that they should expect some catch up and to allow 10% of the purchase price for catch up. It doesn't always run that high. Maggie didn't run much extra at all, but it does often enough that if you consider the 10% as part of the acquisition cost, you will be much less disappointed.

I trust that you are not suggesting that Tim Talley would perform a lot of discretionary work without consulting the owner. I certainly didn't read him that way, though I haven't had him do an annual as I do my own.

No, I would not infer that Tim Talley (whom I know well) would do something without consulting his customer. Not all shops have those rules.

Here is where you and I (and sometimes Pat Keefer) come apart. We don't know who the respondent is. We don't know the circumstances of his purchase. We don't know when (or why) he wants the annual. All we know is that he is a new owner of a 180...nothing about his expectations, or prior experience.

With inadequate background I hesitate to apply what might called the "school solution".

Too often here and at COF we assume we know what a respondent wants, needs, and can, or can not, afford. I prefer to smoke that out before offering advice. I'd like to know name, aircraft N#, condition, location and pilot experience. I try to find out. Tim Talley is a reliable, convenient and agreeable solution...but probably not the only one is the Metroplex area.

No need to reply because we are in agreement about first annuals.

We know enough. We can reasonably infer that he wants an annual inspection because the FAA requires him to get one. I have yet to meet someone who does them for fun, though some might say that I get kind of close on my airplane when changing the oil. Further, we can infer that he wants to actually fly the aircraft, rather than taxi it around the airfield. We know that the Comanche will not go much slower than 75 mph, which means that at its slowest, it is going just fast enough to kill the occupants.

Regardless of his serial number, N#, name, etc., I don't recommend shopping for the cheapest annual. I will not recommend someone who does crappy, cheap annuals. Since he asked a Comanche group for a recommendation, we can reasonably infer that it was hoping for an IA who could do more than recognize a Comanche on the ramp.

Where we come apart is that you like to insert yourself into people's lives unbidden. Pat and I do not do that, though either of use are happy to answer questions in private, email, or on the phone, if the other person wishes to make that contact.

Well that certainly puts me in my place. "Unbidden"...however, one size does not fit all.

Not everyone changes his (or her) bungies annually.

Interesting discussion! Thanks for the information and the recommendations.